As a clicker I am a little upset the WM can just change their TOS when ever to what ever they want I think they should Have to follow some rules and guide lines as well I know there are NO laws governing the PTR, PTC on the internet if there was the BAD ONES wouldnt be allowed to run off with our money I am sorry FRUAD IS FRUAD wether its on the net or in the real world if you steal money from someone its wrong and changing your TOS to make it harder for your members to get payout. I mean if your TOS state you will reach payout at $10.00 then change you TOS to $20.00 after members have reached the ten dolar payout to me that is FRUAD and you have broken your contract with the people who have signed up and have placed trust in your program.
I am a member of alot of sites over 30 PTR, PTC sites I read each email I am given But to force me to use my hard erned money I clicked so hard to get and turn around an tell me I cant cash out because you changed the rules. Or threaten me that I should want to give it all back to you to advertize your site or you will remove me for not advertizing your site....well its your job to advertize your own site not mine I didnt sign up to advertize for you I signed up to GET PAID TO READ AND CLICK. WOW that felt good to get off my chest....I know this is probley and old complaint. But I am tired of all the threats and come on people we are wise to all the whinning about well my family is injail and and my cat is stuck up a tree oh waaaaaaaa I got my period today......... STOP ripping us off with you ###### loop holes and pay us for the 1000s of hours we put in for the measly 1/6 0f a 1/8 of a pennie you claim to be sending us....OH PLEASE. Ok now how many WM are going to delete me today for my freedom of speech..........I love the internet and all its joys.......

I agree that this can be rather frustrating. However, an honest webmaster/webmistress (and there ARE some), would possibly understand if you wrote them a polite email advising that you do not agree with the TOS, you had already reached payout, and that you would like to now quit the program (as you should if you do not agree with the TOS) and would like to be at least paid out based on the previous TOS.

I know this has been mentioned around here before. I'm sure some WMs can shed some light on this with you.

However, it usually DOES say in the TOS that they can change the TOS providing they give some notice to members.

Give it a try, you never know.

Well Said!!! I know a few that has changed the TOS when they start getting alot of members nearing payouts... or better yet all of a sudden just had a crash and lost the database info... come on now... servers dont crash that much, that hard nor that often... this is NOT fair.... if the program owners cant pay don't send out... but don't sit there and just change the TOS or up the min. payouts just because u can or because u are over ya head.... get a grip program owners that do things type of cheating practices.... we do work very hard and read an endless stream of emails just to get to that $$$$ so why not do as u promise... if we have to read ans surf and search or risk being deleted, then the least that u could do is hold u're end of the deal and pay out!
Not all program owners do these scamming techinics.. this isn't what I'm saying, but there are a few that does... some of them I could have swore was honest... they wil say that something is wrong with the servers or whatever that they are going down for a while and then just buy into other programs and abandon the other programs they have because they don't want to paypout or change the terms to make it impossible to reach etc.... we are all tired of excuses... we don't claim to be perfect... I know I don't, but come on... give us a break, deleting because of not promoting... thats getting just alittle bit testy isn't it? lol... good luck Georgia and everyone else.... and much success in all you may do!
Hyper

I don't see a problem with changing TOS as long as you're fair about it.

I have changed a couple of things in mine, but not payout.

However, as far as I'm concerned, any PO changing payout terms has a responsibility to first payout the members who have reached the original payout. SO if you needed $10 for payout and he changes it to $20, everyone already at or over $10 should be paid.

Otherwise, I agree, it is Fraud. I think that POs should always have the money available to pay their members, so raising payout really shouldn't be necessary.

I think if they want to change the payout they should at least pay the ones out that dont want to agree to the new terms. I mean really you have $5.00 in your account payout it at $10 an your TOS changes payout to $20. Whats the big deal with giving the people that money so they can go somewhere else instead of forcing them to either stay and deal with it or quit and forfeit. Who is to say that when they get close to $20 you wont change it to $30. That would make a lot of people happy and maybe give some people a reason to stick around. I think that would give a lot of honest programs a better reputation and make members a lot happier if they were actually given a reasonable choice. Not a "Its my site if you dont like it to bad" attitude. I really think there are a lot of WM out there that are honest and just dont know how to compromise so they get a bad reputation when people are forced to quit or stay because they want the money they have worked for. But this is bound to be a topic of unhappiness for a long time lol

Which brings me to....

I got to 5000 points on Mystical as the poll went up. I earned those 5000 points under the terms of their being worth $1, and by clicking links on the site, not doing some autosurf thing. Now you are mulling it over and the option to convert is gone.

How fair is that? I'd like my one dollar, please.

Wow I think thats awful that they do that! I have only been a member of PTC programs for about a week and a half now but I hope none of the ones Im a member of do that! What are some of the programs that have done that?

Too many to list!!

I agree or at least leave FIRST payout at $10, then any following payments if you choose to stay would be at $20.

I had 4,800 and some points when I got the email. I clciked everything I could to get the $1. Now my points are devalued because I couldn't cash out in time.

If there is a Support Folder for the program here, you can write something for the program owner about the problem. Otherwise, write a polite email to them.

I understand the frustration, too and I'm pretty sure lots of these POs do NOT have the funds in an account to pay members. That is why they leave a window of 30 to 90 days and some even longer. It's irresponsible to ask members to wait so long after reaching payout. I would be ashamed to ask people to wait for more than 30 days after knowing that every single cent they earned was supposedly paid for by the advertiser except for the sign-up bonus.

jbjgirlforever,

If your looking for programs not to join my best suggestion would be go through this complaint folder looking at programs that have MANY MANY complaints about payout or no contact from WM when you email them. Another good place to find programs that you DO NOT WANT TO JOIN is gptboycott.com. Hope this helps. But still your gonna eventually run into a program that will run off with your earnings, have a real mysterious hacker or data base crash.

Hope that helps

The statement above is in just about EVERY program's TOS. It is the responsiblity of every member to read the terms thoroughly before signing up to the programs.

Now, that being said, I do agree the PO's should email the members of the changes. Most usually do by sending update emails. If a member does not agree with the changes in the terms, such as changing payout amounts, then they should, by all means, let the PO know the situation. If the member is at or over the original payout amount, then the PO, if they are honest, should abide by the original TOS.
(Remember this though, if you do not agree with the new TOS, do not click on any more links. Once you do, you are bound to the new TOS. The PO's also have that in their Terms.)

As a WM I believe if you change your terms about payout you need only pay people have previously requested payout based on your old terms.

If people WERE at minimum and did not request they obviously felt the need to wait longer and earn more anyways so it should not be that big of a deal to them.

Some POs seem to want to take this a step further and demand compliance, or unsubscribe. They leave no room for debate, discussion or requests. It's either their way or the highway.

So, having an attitude like that, I will unsubscribe then post in forums to warn potential new members about that program. They leave us no other choice.

Also, I unsubscribed from SendMoreInfo after having been a member for ages because of the pathetic new change in point conversion. I sent them an email politely describing why I unsubscribed and I never heard from them.

Well of course its their way or the highway!

Its their site, they may run it however they want too. If they are stupid and make stupid changes they will pay in the long run. If they make good changes it will affect them in a good way.

But in the end its always the WMs way that is why they are paying you!

No, they're paying us to make money for THEM.

Without us, clicking their ads, they make zilch.

This is why some many WM become so unpopular, as they forget who needs who, we can move to another site, they lose us, they lose their paying ads.

POWER TO THE PEOPLE

As long as they have that attitude, that we are overhead instead of profit, they will not be as successful as they could be.

With all these GPTRs out there I think there should be standards: per say, changing the amount of payouts. In the legal system, when changes are made in laws, they must include a 'grandfather's clause.'

What that means is, if any GPTR program decides to change their payout, they should set an effective 'join' date.

Example: Let's say it takes 3 months to reach payout, on average, and the wm wants to up the amount of payout. Set the date according to the join date.

If a member joined 3 months before the new payout and has reached the old payout, pay that member. If a member joined 2 months before the new tos, but has earned 2/3 of the old payout, give him the opportunity to earn the rest in another month and pay him under the old terms. All other members, who have not reached 2/3 of the old amount must wait until they reach the new amount to be paid.

Not only is this fair to the reliable members, it's an incentive for them to remain with the program.

I don't think honest wms would have a problem with that. Any wm that balks about it would be those who have no intentions to pay their members.

I think the only ones who do this are wm's that are inexperienced in business practices or out to rip you off.