My God, if I were truly made in his/her/its image and he truly loved me would want me to know without any doubt or need of proof that he/she/it exists. Why must I seek to find? Why don't I "know" inherently"? (automatically)
Let's discuss it, if you are into this.
Full Version: Religion - "My God"
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Don't waste your time trying to find anything - because you cannot find a figment of differing collective imaginations
JoeP
JoeP
Wow...one doesn't often find topics of this sort on public boards nowadays. Having been an acting Minister for nearly 4 years I just can't wait to see the replies to this OP.
I would be happy to chime in but will happily await a few more replies before doing so.
I would be happy to chime in but will happily await a few more replies before doing so.
Why would such an omnipotent God need my worship or praise? Wouldn't that be "part of the deal" and implied (him/her all-knowing my every thought as a "prayer"?)
QUOTE (JoeProbe @ Mar 6 2009, 03:02 PM) 
Don't waste your time trying to find anything - because you cannot find a figment of differing collective imaginations
JoeP
JoeP
Is it true? is religion just a contrived "opium of the masses" for the purposes of control? I feel not (though I have no proof to fall back upon.)
QUOTE (LzzrdBoy @ Mar 6 2009, 09:24 PM)
Wow...one doesn't often find topics of this sort on public boards nowadays. Having been an acting Minister for nearly 4 years I just can't wait to see the replies to this OP.
I would be happy to chime in but will happily await a few more replies before doing so.
I would be happy to chime in but will happily await a few more replies before doing so.
In response to your post, I'm glad that you said you were an acting Minister, because that is all that it is .. an act.
I have no hesitation in stating that everyone should be allowed their beliefs, but that is all it is - a belief. No facts, no proof, just an impression that has been gathered after centuries of what can only effectively be called Chinese Whispers.
Although I willingly stand to be corrected, the stories of God/Christ, Allah, Buddah and many other forms of perceived deity, are nothing more than folklores handed down through the generations.
QUOTE (FreeCashPro @ Mar 6 2009, 09:41 PM)
Why would such an omnipotent God need my worship or praise? Wouldn't that be "part of the deal" and implied (him/her all-knowing my every thought as a "prayer"?)
The belief that any God is omnipotent is purely based in the teachings of the aforementioned actors throughout millenia.
As for this omnipotent being knowing your every thought, that is not un-akin to parents telling their offspring that Santa knows exactly what they want for Xmas, or that the tooth-fairy knows when to leave that coin under their pillow,
JoeP
"Dear God"
, hope you got the letter, and...
I pray you can make it better down here.
I don't mean a big reduction in the price of beer
but all the people that you made in your image, see
them starving on their feet 'cause they don't get
enough to eat from God, I can't believe in you
Dear God, sorry to disturb you, but... I feel that I should be heard
loud and clear. We all need a big reduction in amount of tears
and all the people that you made in your image, see them fighting
in the street 'cause they can't make opinions meet about God,
I can't believe in you
Did you make disease, and the diamond blue? Did you make
mankind after we made you? And the devil too!
, don't know if you noticed, but... your name is on
a lot of quotes in this book, and us crazy humans wrote it, you
should take a look, and all the people that you made in your
image still believing that junk is true. Well I know it ain't, and
so do you, dear God, I can't believe in I don't believe in
I won't believe in heaven and hell. No saints, no sinners, no
devil as well. No pearly gates, no thorny crown. You're always
letting us humans down. The wars you bring, the babes you
drown. Those lost at sea and never found, and it's the same the
whole world 'round. The hurt I see helps to compound that
Father, Son and Holy Ghost is just somebody's unholy hoax,
and if you're up there you'd perceive that my heart's here upon
my sleeve. If there's one thing I don't believe in
it's you....
, hope you got the letter, and...
I pray you can make it better down here.
I don't mean a big reduction in the price of beer
but all the people that you made in your image, see
them starving on their feet 'cause they don't get
enough to eat from God, I can't believe in you
Dear God, sorry to disturb you, but... I feel that I should be heard
loud and clear. We all need a big reduction in amount of tears
and all the people that you made in your image, see them fighting
in the street 'cause they can't make opinions meet about God,
I can't believe in you
Did you make disease, and the diamond blue? Did you make
mankind after we made you? And the devil too!
, don't know if you noticed, but... your name is on
a lot of quotes in this book, and us crazy humans wrote it, you
should take a look, and all the people that you made in your
image still believing that junk is true. Well I know it ain't, and
so do you, dear God, I can't believe in I don't believe in
I won't believe in heaven and hell. No saints, no sinners, no
devil as well. No pearly gates, no thorny crown. You're always
letting us humans down. The wars you bring, the babes you
drown. Those lost at sea and never found, and it's the same the
whole world 'round. The hurt I see helps to compound that
Father, Son and Holy Ghost is just somebody's unholy hoax,
and if you're up there you'd perceive that my heart's here upon
my sleeve. If there's one thing I don't believe in
it's you....
QUOTE (FreeCashPro @ Mar 6 2009, 10:05 PM)
Is it true? is religion just a contrived "opium of the masses" for the purposes of control? I feel not (though I have no proof to fall back upon.)
Although many incidents in history may have suggested this might be the case (e.g. the practices of the Catholic Church, the Spanish Inquisition, stonings), in this day and age it is far from any control purposes.
It is nothing more than a benign gathering of individuals who have a need to believe in a superior power to bring meaning to their own unfullfilled lives - inasmuch that they themselves cannot take control of their own fates believing that there is a higher power that does so, thereby giving them relief in "knowing" that their actions in life are out of their own hands
JoeP
QUOTE (JoeProbe @ Mar 6 2009, 04:19 PM)
Although many incidents in history may have suggested this might be the case (e.g. the practices of the Catholic Church, the Spanish Inquisition, stonings), in this day and age it is far from any control purposes.
It is nothing more than a benign gathering of individuals who have a need to believe in a superior power to bring meaning to their own unfullfilled lives - inasmuch that they themselves cannot take control of their own fates believing that there is a higher power that does so, thereby giving them relief in "knowing" that their actions in life are out of their own hands
JoeP
It is nothing more than a benign gathering of individuals who have a need to believe in a superior power to bring meaning to their own unfullfilled lives - inasmuch that they themselves cannot take control of their own fates believing that there is a higher power that does so, thereby giving them relief in "knowing" that their actions in life are out of their own hands
JoeP
Ok, so we are merely animals that have evolved to this point who inevitably die and get eaten by worms. No "afterlife" unless you consider the protein contained within worm food. I would be ok with this, I just want to know.
QUOTE (FreeCashPro @ Mar 6 2009, 10:25 PM)
Ok, so we are merely animals that have evolved to this point who inevitably die and get eaten by worms. No "afterlife" unless you consider the protein contained within worm food. I would be ok with this, I just want to know.
Yep, that's pretty much it.
Our ultimate end is to be nothing more than a fertiliser - no matter what form that takes - mulch or crispy
JoeP
QUOTE (JoeProbe @ Mar 6 2009, 04:35 PM)
Yep, that's pretty much it.
Our ultimate end is to be nothing more than a fertiliser - no matter what form that takes - mulch or crispy
JoeP
Our ultimate end is to be nothing more than a fertiliser - no matter what form that takes - mulch or crispy
JoeP
But we have this drive to procreate. And the survival of the fittest (though it's kind of being short-circuited by our "amends" we make for the disabled) Are we truly going toward a better human being any more (as I take we have been bred through centuries to do?) Or is it all pointless now?
Is our "body" just a vehicle for our mind to experience what we were meant to experience?
QUOTE (JoeProbe @ Mar 6 2009, 04:12 PM)
In response to your post, I'm glad that you said you were an acting Minister, because that is all that it is .. an act.
I have no hesitation in stating that everyone should be allowed their beliefs, but that is all it is - a belief. No facts, no proof, just an impression that has been gathered after centuries of what can only effectively be called Chinese Whispers.
Although I willingly stand to be corrected, the stories of God/Christ, Allah, Buddah and many other forms of perceived deity, are nothing more than folklores handed down through the generations.
The belief that any God is omnipotent is purely based in the teachings of the aforementioned actors throughout millenia.
As for this omnipotent being knowing your every thought, that is not un-akin to parents telling their offspring that Santa knows exactly what they want for Xmas, or that the tooth-fairy knows when to leave that coin under their pillow,
JoeP
I have no hesitation in stating that everyone should be allowed their beliefs, but that is all it is - a belief. No facts, no proof, just an impression that has been gathered after centuries of what can only effectively be called Chinese Whispers.
Although I willingly stand to be corrected, the stories of God/Christ, Allah, Buddah and many other forms of perceived deity, are nothing more than folklores handed down through the generations.
The belief that any God is omnipotent is purely based in the teachings of the aforementioned actors throughout millenia.
As for this omnipotent being knowing your every thought, that is not un-akin to parents telling their offspring that Santa knows exactly what they want for Xmas, or that the tooth-fairy knows when to leave that coin under their pillow,
JoeP
So, "The Bible" is just a popular "bestseller" full of folklore? I truly believe that it is much more than that only it has been misinterpreted and misunderstood over the many years. Jesus Christ is a known historical figure who's life can be traced by empirical science through history.
I, only, can't come to a conclusion that he, Jesus Christ, was the only bearer of wisdom that must be passed down and understood fully. I believe that, equally, other prophets such as Budha, Mohammed, and Ghandi (etc. etc.) and their teachings must be weighed and analyzed to come to your own truth (and hence, your own ultimate understanding of your role here in "life")
Anyone else on the same page as I?
QUOTE (FreeCashPro @ Mar 6 2009, 10:40 PM)
But we have this drive to procreate. And the survival of the fittest (though it's kind of being short-circuited by our "amends" we make for the disabled) Are we truly going toward a better human being any more (as I take we have been bred through centuries to do?) Or is it all pointless now?
In that sense, human beings are no different to any other living creature - all have the drive to procreate.
Survival of the fittest only applies to the non-human animal kingdom. Except in the case of certain historical misguided persons, and perhaps a few involved in current medical practices, human beings - despite a multitude of attempts at cleansing and/or indoctrination - will always produce a future pool of healthy and non-healthy individuals. That is life.
QUOTE (FreeCashPro @ Mar 6 2009, 10:42 PM)
Is our "body" just a vehicle for our mind to experience what we were meant to experience?
I had never thought of the body as being such a vehicle - it's an interesting concept - but my immediate reaction would be to say that no, that is not the case.
The human body indeed provides for every single one of our experiences, but your suggestion implies that there is a meaning to our existence. To have such a meaning, could be seen by some as implying that something (eg a superior power) gave us that meaning. I prefer to believe that we are a fluke of nature ..... there but for the grace of ...... a meteorite 65 million years ago
But let me ask you one back .............
Do you believe that the only life that exists can be found on planet Earth, or do you believe that life - in whatever form - may exist elsewhere in the Universe?
JoeP
QUOTE (FreeCashPro @ Mar 6 2009, 10:54 PM)
So, "The Bible" is just a popular "bestseller" full of folklore?
In a nutshell - yes.
That "created in 7 days" stuff - priceless
QUOTE (FreeCashPro @ Mar 6 2009, 10:54 PM)
I truly believe that it is much more than that only it has been misinterpreted and misunderstood over the many years. Jesus Christ is a known historical figure who's life can be traced by empirical science through history.
The Bible is a gathering of stories handed down over the years (my reference to Chinese Whispers above refers). Lets face it, the "Bible" (certainly in its current format) could not possibly exist in the first 14/15 centuries after the time of Christ as there was no means of mass-producing the printed word.
Any "copies" of a Bible would surely have to be hand-written, and as such - should they even exist - be retained in places of reverance such as monasteries, very much out of sight of the common man - never mind the fact that the ability to read was a priviledge afforded to so very few.
QUOTE (FreeCashPro @ Mar 6 2009, 10:54 PM)
I, only, can't come to a conclusion that he, Jesus Christ, was the only bearer of wisdom that must be passed down and understood fully. I believe that, equally, other prophets such as Budha, Mohammed, and Ghandi (etc. etc.) and their teachings must be weighed and analyzed to come to your own truth (and hence, your own ultimate understanding of your role here in "life")
Anyone else on the same page as I?
Anyone else on the same page as I?
I agree, Christ could very well have been a bearer of wisdom - a wise man of the time. What he was not was a human being born of a virgin mother impregnated by a mythical being.
But then, Stephen Hawkins is a wise man too - I'd hardly call him a prophet
JoeP
QUOTE (JoeProbe @ Mar 6 2009, 05:14 PM)
In a nutshell - yes.
That "created in 7 days" stuff - priceless
The Bible is a gathering of stories handed down over the years (my reference to Chinese Whispers above refers). Lets face it, the "Bible" (certainly in its current format) could not possibly exist in the first 14/15 centuries after the time of Christ as there was no means of mass-producing the printed word.
Any "copies" of a Bible would surely have to be hand-written, and as such - should they even exist - be retained in places of reverance such as monasteries, very much out of sight of the common man - never mind the fact that the ability to read was a priviledge afforded to so very few.
I agree, Christ could very well have been a bearer of wisdom - a wise man of the time. What he was not was a human being born of a virgin mother impregnated by a mythical being.
But then, Stephen Hawkins is a wise man too - I'd hardly call him a prophet
JoeP
That "created in 7 days" stuff - priceless
The Bible is a gathering of stories handed down over the years (my reference to Chinese Whispers above refers). Lets face it, the "Bible" (certainly in its current format) could not possibly exist in the first 14/15 centuries after the time of Christ as there was no means of mass-producing the printed word.
Any "copies" of a Bible would surely have to be hand-written, and as such - should they even exist - be retained in places of reverance such as monasteries, very much out of sight of the common man - never mind the fact that the ability to read was a priviledge afforded to so very few.
I agree, Christ could very well have been a bearer of wisdom - a wise man of the time. What he was not was a human being born of a virgin mother impregnated by a mythical being.
But then, Stephen Hawkins is a wise man too - I'd hardly call him a prophet
JoeP
Yes, if we were really in a "survival of the fittest" situation I don't think any of us would know the name Stephen Hawkins... But I a believer that brains is what we (as humans) are going for instead of brawn(muscles) so, maybe, who knows, he may be our most enlightened teacher.
Ok, this may be too tripped out for most of you to grasp but here I am in my "existence" and the only "theory" I have to such existence is this:
We are spiritual beings having a physical experience that we have signed up for.
All that we see and feel through our senses is made for us (like our own little movie.) We are meant to learn lessons. Our movie gives us positive and negative reinforcement in learning those lessons. Everything we see and feel is made for us the instant it comes into view.
Or, is this really self-centered egotistical bullshit?
Anyone else ever feel this way?
This is an incredibly selfish way to go through life - I feel I may be wrong (in this paradigm people are too easily mistaken for "props")
We are spiritual beings having a physical experience that we have signed up for.
All that we see and feel through our senses is made for us (like our own little movie.) We are meant to learn lessons. Our movie gives us positive and negative reinforcement in learning those lessons. Everything we see and feel is made for us the instant it comes into view.
Or, is this really self-centered egotistical bullshit?
Anyone else ever feel this way?
This is an incredibly selfish way to go through life - I feel I may be wrong (in this paradigm people are too easily mistaken for "props")
Aha !! Now I get it - I see where you are coming from.
You've just been watching "The Matrix"
JoeP
You've just been watching "The Matrix"
JoeP
QUOTE (JoeProbe @ Mar 6 2009, 06:03 PM)
Aha !! Now I get it - I see where you are coming from.
You've just been watching "The Matrix"
JoeP
You've just been watching "The Matrix"
JoeP
Yes, The Matrix had an indelible impression upon me though I had been feeling it long before...
...if you accept the above premise then my job here on earth is to gather data. This thread is an attempt at that.
QUOTE (FreeCashPro @ Mar 7 2009, 01:47 AM)
Ok, this may be too tripped out for most of you to grasp but here I am in my "existence" and the only "theory" I have to such existence is this:
We are spiritual beings having a physical experience that we have signed up for.
All that we see and feel through our senses is made for us (like our own little movie.) We are meant to learn lessons. Our movie gives us positive and negative reinforcement in learning those lessons. Everything we see and feel is made for us the instant it comes into view.
Or, is this really self-centered egotistical ######?
Anyone else ever feel this way?
This is an incredibly selfish way to go through life - I feel I may be wrong (in this paradigm people are too easily mistaken for "props")
We are spiritual beings having a physical experience that we have signed up for.
All that we see and feel through our senses is made for us (like our own little movie.) We are meant to learn lessons. Our movie gives us positive and negative reinforcement in learning those lessons. Everything we see and feel is made for us the instant it comes into view.
Or, is this really self-centered egotistical ######?
Anyone else ever feel this way?
This is an incredibly selfish way to go through life - I feel I may be wrong (in this paradigm people are too easily mistaken for "props")
I felt exactly like this when I was a child, but to me it felt like I was being fooled. I was convinced it was all someone's idea of a big joke and I was IT, the joke!
I was a confused kid
QUOTE (MandyMooCow @ Mar 7 2009, 01:18 AM)
I felt exactly like this when I was a child, but to me it felt like I was being fooled. I was convinced it was all someone's idea of a big joke and I was IT, the joke!
I was a confused kid
I was a confused kid
Ok, I'm 44 years old. I seek to be enlightened. This is the stage I am in. Can you help me?
What are your truths? Why are they truths for you?
QUOTE (JoeProbe @ Mar 6 2009, 05:12 PM)
In response to your post, I'm glad that you said you were an acting Minister, because that is all that it is .. an act.
I have no hesitation in stating that everyone should be allowed their beliefs, but that is all it is - a belief. No facts, no proof, just an impression that has been gathered after centuries of what can only effectively be called Chinese Whispers.
Although I willingly stand to be corrected, the stories of God/Christ, Allah, Buddah and many other forms of perceived deity, are nothing more than folklores handed down through the generations.
The belief that any God is omnipotent is purely based in the teachings of the aforementioned actors throughout millenia.
As for this omnipotent being knowing your every thought, that is not un-akin to parents telling their offspring that Santa knows exactly what they want for Xmas, or that the tooth-fairy knows when to leave that coin under their pillow,
JoeP
I have no hesitation in stating that everyone should be allowed their beliefs, but that is all it is - a belief. No facts, no proof, just an impression that has been gathered after centuries of what can only effectively be called Chinese Whispers.
Although I willingly stand to be corrected, the stories of God/Christ, Allah, Buddah and many other forms of perceived deity, are nothing more than folklores handed down through the generations.
The belief that any God is omnipotent is purely based in the teachings of the aforementioned actors throughout millenia.
As for this omnipotent being knowing your every thought, that is not un-akin to parents telling their offspring that Santa knows exactly what they want for Xmas, or that the tooth-fairy knows when to leave that coin under their pillow,
JoeP
I stated I was an acting Minister but I never stated I believed in a "god"! And kudos to you...I'm less than 10 posts into this board and already you're insulting me! Surely FreeCashPro has a cookie or something similar he can toss your way in honor of your achievement! Congratz!
I am not the proselytizing, "pushing-religion-down-your-throat" sort, but since you ASKED...
I know there is a God because I feel his presence, and I talk to him every day.
Some might find that foolish. This is their right.
My faith sustains me.
For those of you who are nonbelievers, I've always been curious about something:
Don't you feel empty 'knowing' that there is nothing in store for us, besides this life?
What a terrible thought
(note: please don't sue, opinions were solicited, that's the only reason I said anything...LOL)
I know there is a God because I feel his presence, and I talk to him every day.
Some might find that foolish. This is their right.
My faith sustains me.
For those of you who are nonbelievers, I've always been curious about something:
Don't you feel empty 'knowing' that there is nothing in store for us, besides this life?
What a terrible thought
(note: please don't sue, opinions were solicited, that's the only reason I said anything...LOL)
My God wants me to love Him because I want to, not because I have to. My God wants the world to do the same, hence He allows us all to have free will to do as we choose. My God is heartbroken at the choices we have made, even though he has set forth time and again the way we should live to attain true happiness in the world He created.
I just have to toss in my two cents here. I don't know that there is a God. I have tried to believe that there is one or more than one, but I guess that until it is proven to me I won't. I think that the only reason people want to believe that there is a God is to justify their actions..What I mean by that is this: look at how many people go out drink, do drugs, shot other people, rob people, etc, but on Sundays they all of a sudden beliee in God. I believe that it is the Catholics who say that God is the son of Mary and not Jesus. You can tell me if I somehow heard the pastor wrong, or he was mistaken, but the bible proves otherwise. In my opinion religion is something to give others hope and something to believe in. I don't have anything against any religion. I just have not found one that fits me yet and maybe someday I will. I remember one of the first times I ever went to church and people used to get dressed up to go, but nowadays people look like they are wearing te same thing that they wore to bed.
The Books inside the Bible were chosen by Constantinopla at his time of kingdom. I believe that the believe has books that were chosen only for political reasons...ones that were best for them at there time. That is why the Catholic Church still does not accept the hidden Books (In Spanish it is called "evangelios Apocrifos") which explain the life of Jesus after 12....
You have to believe in something that does not exist...that is what faith is....believing in something that you cant see. God made us different in shape, size and color. He made us to his imagination and perfect in every part of the word. He mad us Symmetric. You have 2 eyes, two hands, two feet, etc.... Our bodies are perfect in every sense of the word... We have to believe that God and the Demon really exist and that the demon surrounds us and tempts us every single day but its up to us to defend ourselves.
This is a really interesting topic not seen around that much
This is a really interesting topic not seen around that much
I see a lot of people neither showing apathy nor interest about the entity of GOD... A lot of people would believe only what their naked eye can see... We breathe by the air which we can't see and lived by the world which we're not able to discover/know whose the owner is... I lived by God who's not visible hence i believed in HIS existence,as much as I believe there's Heaven and Hell... I have nothin' to lose If I would lived by my beliefs or not... But I care much about my soul... What If God never really exist? What if the Bible says isn't true? What If God Is just a Human? ---I would say, Oh really, It's fine at least nothing would I lose... On tyhe other hand, What if God do exist? What if the Bible says is true? What If Jesus is God? ---I woulld say, At least I believed in HIM, and I lived by His rules... I have told you about Him didn't I? But you refused to believe me, so blame me not!!! 
I have a question...why did God create Man in His image, and then make him capable of such heinous sin that He would have to give "his only begotten son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life" (John 3:16, more or less)? I know God created Man in His image, and gave him free will--but then to let him screw up so egregriously that He has to kill His own son so that we wouldn't all burn in Hell?!?
I am a Christian, having a crisis of faith ATM
I am a Christian, having a crisis of faith ATM
I just noticed I had 7666 posts...aaaahhh! 
I had to make that 7667, I have OCD...LOL
Just do me a favor...study the human body, intensely, for 1 mo. and tell me that's just coincidence...ya right!
It's nothing short of miraculous...for instance, why don't ALL of us get sick, all the time? study the immune system...the odds of that being created by chance, ya right!!
I had to make that 7667, I have OCD...LOL
Just do me a favor...study the human body, intensely, for 1 mo. and tell me that's just coincidence...ya right!
It's nothing short of miraculous...for instance, why don't ALL of us get sick, all the time? study the immune system...the odds of that being created by chance, ya right!!
my god is me 
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