Well, I suppose you have all seen this type of complaint before. Still I need to get this out to all those who support this con artist.

I have been active in the paid industry for over 3 years, since the early days of All Advantage, and in those 3 years have never met anyone like the owner of TopDollarEmails, PaidWorld and Cash4Hits. His arrogance, selfisheness, rudeness and self pity take the biscuit.

Why? Well here goes! I have held back the following for a few months now but due to the fact that yesterday Stilwel cancelled my account at TopDollarEmails for no constructive reason, I feel that I need to make everyone aware of what has transpired over the past few months and what will be happening over the next few days regards to Stilwell.

No doubt I will have my critics (I won't mention who but can take bets should anyone wish to open a book!

So let's start:

Please have a look at what I posted on GPTBoycott via this link - http://www.gptboycott.com/programs/program...Topdollaremails

You can see there was no attack, simply a statement saying I had requested payment but had not been paid for many months.

Then I received the following personally from Stilwel. This is a copy of the email conversation we had.

JS - Personal attacks, libel, and other attacks on me or my programs will get
your account at all of my sites terminated.

Earners - What attacks?

JS - On GPT Boycott - False boycott attempts are grounds for termination. It is an attack.

Earners - I don't think so. I stated a fact - nothing more, nothing less, a fact
that I have been waiting over 6 months for payment. I even stated that I had previously been paid! There is no attack whatsoever.

JS - You are not allowed to threaten or attack me.

Earners - Then be it on your head. You are going to cancel my account for telling the truth? That post is staying and should you cancel my accounts for which I have evidence of earnings and previous communications then matters will be taken further and I'm sure there are many others that will support action against you. Now this is a warning to you.

JS - My terms state members will be paid and they are. I was banned because of a child molster and points2cash. Again if you do not remove the attack on me and my prgrams your account WILL be terminated. This si your last email from me.

That was the last communication from Stilwel, received on 18th December 2002.

Yesterday on 1st March, 3 months late I received this:

As per your attack at http://www.gptboycott.com/programs/program...Topdollaremails your account has been deleted.

So as far as I am concerned Stilwel just didn't want to pay. Here is a copy of my stats from 4 days ago:

You have directly earned: $3.9635
You have earned from your Downline: $102.6642
Your account balance after all transactions: $65.5828
You have directly earned: 0 Points
You have earned from your Downline: 73 Points
Total available points after all transactions: 73 Points
Downline Count
#1 #2 #3 #4 #5 #6
6 41 93 149 125 164
Total: 578

So what do I want? What is the purpose of this post?

Primarily it is to make all aware of Mr John Stilwel's fraudulent activities and hopefully to stop members supporting this scammer.Yes - I do have a grudge against this person and over the next few weeks will be doing my upmost to stop him in his tracks.

So a message to all you program owners - do us all a favour, cancel this persons account in your program, stop him earning money and refusing to pay his members. I think most of you can see what this person is up to. He will never pay people the way he should be doing. STOP HIM IN HIS TRACKS - DON'T GIVE HIM A PENNY. He usually uses the name venomx on your programs.

And a message to all you members of his sites - cancel your account, you'll not be paid and you are giving him referrals for his programs by reading his emails!

I am not the first person to be scammed by him. There are plenty of threads here and on other forums.

For those of you who have been scammed or have not been paid, contact me, give me information, send me the emails you have had from him so at least we can get together and send complaints to everyone this scammer has dealings with.

It's about time members spoke up, dealt with the situation and stopped this type of scammer once and for all. Have we not had enough??

I certainly have!

Marc

Oboy!
The gloves are OFF.

Hi,

You might be right about John Stilwelln it's even a bit funny when you say it's about time members spoke up, many have already and especially here

But one thing I really disagree with, you blame him for not paying you/cancel his account and you suggest to other owners to cancel his account or to not pay him ... so you suggest they should do to him what you blame him for ?

If someone has stolen in my house, does it give me the right to go in his house and rob there ?

Sophie

>>>If someone has stolen in my house, does it give me the right to go in his house and rob there ?<<<

No, but it gives you the right to make a complaint to the relevant authorities to try to stop this person doing it again.

It also gives you the right to decide whether you should pay this person only for yourself not to be paid.

Marc

Yes Marc, but that is not what you were saying above, you asked other owners to cancel ven's account and not pay him .... you didn't ask them to go to the relevant authorities .... or is it that late and my english that bad ? ;-)

I ask others to send me details of dealings with this scammer. Why? Because if no-one else will then I will present as much evidence about him as possible to all other partied that Stilwel has dealings with. That is why I ask for information.

And yes I'll say it again - program owners should cancel his account and not pay him a penny. Why should we? He has strung us along for long enough. He's broke his own terms time after time. It's in our terms, we don't need a reason.
Members should also cancel their accounts and not give him any support.

Pay him nothing, he's gained his referrals and earnings under false pretences as far as myself and many others are concerned.

Like you say there are many that have spoken but where has it gone - nowhere. Enough is enough.

I am not giving him support but I thought you were not like that, he also has in his terms that he can change TOS when he wants to and he can cancel accounts, all gptsites have that .... the TOS only exist for the members to follow them, not the owners .... it's been like that since the beginning.

I am disappointed you advice to everyone to do what you blame him for, it makes no sense to me .... and if you do to him what he did to you, it makes you just like him and you won't be able to go to the relevant authorities anymore ... complaining there about what, about something you did as well ?

Sophie

Sophie, let me ask you a couple of questions:

Are you a member of TopDollarEmails, Cash4Hits and PaidWorld?
What is your balance on each program?

Hmmmm, don't think it's relevant ;-)

But as you're so curious : I have one account at one of his sites ... no clue what my earnings could be, I joined in the beginning and after some disagreements with Venomx, I now only keep it active to see what happens there.

Sophie

earners, I'd like nothing more than to see venomx go down in flames, after the immature and disrespectful way in which he has treated his members for far too long, and his continued history of nonpayment. I feel this way especially after reading comments from him like "I reserve the right to not pay whom I please" (on GPTBoycott forum).
However, I must agree with sophieca on this. You are just sinking to his level in what you are asking people to do. I understand you must be very upset, and justifiably so, but I can't support your suggestion either.

earners, have you seen this?

http://www.getpaidforum.com/forums/index.p...080&f=1&t=34429

Is it you?

If so,

Go earners
Go earners
Go earners

*Xena does a silly dance*

Now THAT I support!

Sorry, but I could NEVER EVER stoop that low.

Even if he deleted me from his programs instead of paying me, I couldn't bring myself to delete him in retaliation as long as he's following MY rules in FreeAndEasy.

I know you will never understand my reasoning/concience, but I would need a valid reason to delete him as a member (which I don't think he's a member of mine anyhow, not really sure about that).

Said valid reason would be catching him cheating or something in my program.

2 wrongs don't make a right hehe

very true

even when someone cheats u.. best to do the right thing and at least retain your good reputation

Even with the problems I've had with him, I paid him what he was due last month.

--Kimberley

hehe - i think someone would still keep their reputation.....who was it (jazmyni?) who said that if a program doesn't pay them out, then they will return the favor. i have a great deal of respect for that wm!!

He said he is only in programs that are CC scripts, and the rest are junk. If I do find him in Super, I would keep an watchful eye on him.

I'm going to have a little talk with venomx at GetPaidFYI to get things straight.

Poncer, Venomx never said they where junk. Please continue to search for evidence (Like I'm doing) and not making quick accusings. You know venomx is watching this forums.

I use the mec cc scripts, but I don't think he is a member of mine.

He believes that he was personally attacked by earners.. thats why he deleted the account.. in this thread i see no evidence of that

he claimed he swore at him in emails.. id like 2 see evidence of those emails.. just to see if deleting the account was the rite thing

Believe me Promo. He did said that in a post on another forum. Not sure which forum though.

Looks like he's locked me out so I can't reply to that post. He's also deleted a previous post.

With regards to program owners cancelling him, OK, let's put it this way.

Say as a program owner you have been waiting for payment from him for 6 months and you then see he has redeemed in your program.
Here's the big question - Do you pay him knowing you will probably never get your money?
So maybe I should re-phrase what I said in that program owners "should consider" cancelling him. That way it is an opinion rather than a demand. Is that better!

Regards to him losing his account at Emailsformoney there has been a breakdown in trust and in general employment law a breakdown in trust constitutes dismissal. I know this business is not "employment" but to me it amounts to the same thing.

And I am damned if I will ever let him earn any money from any of my sites, money that other members have put in only for him not to pay his members and use the money elsewhers for example buying and setting up new sites like his GPFY Ignorance forum. This is where our money is going.

Regards to his Paypal account - that's just a start and he knows it.

All I want from others is details of what is owed to them and how long they have waited.

Regards to personal attacks by myself on Stilwell, there have been none whatsoever, all I did was post that I had been waiting over 6 months for payment. In that post I even stated I had been previously paid. At the end of the day he owed me $65+ and needed an excuse to lose the debt. Simple.
I have kept every bit of communication and ALL was printed at the beginning of this thread. There was no swearing or attacks.
If anything does appear then I will state now before it does that anything with attacks or swearing is falsified and should be ignored.

If he owed me money, then no, I wouldn't have paid him. But owing me money was not the problem I had with him. It was because of a rude gesture he made toward my site about a month after I opened it up.

I dropped out of his program before I reached payout because I knew I'd never see my money, and I didn't want to waste anymore time there.


--Kimberley

tut tut tut...I am with earners......DONT pay scammers.....Give him a dose of his own medicine.....If everyone boycotted him together, it would work...dont cancel his account....noooooo...let him keep earning, let him think he is going to get paid...and then dont....e-mail him telling him, he will be paid when you have the money, if he starts yelling scam, delete him, saying sorry, but you may not dis my program...lol..it is justice...I wouldn't think any less of yas...a whole lot of people would send you applause.

close him down...give him no amo (money) to keep scamming people......

I will do the exact same thing as well. If I have a program, I will treat him the same way he treats others.

To be a good, honest webmaster you treat everyone fairly. If members are abiding by the rules you do not delete them. If you sink to those kind of lows Poncer no one would want to be in your program.

I agree with Amy.

I don't agree in deleting a member (webmaster or not) if he is not cheating. Maybe John does not pay his members, maybe he deletes accounts of people who he feel are attacking him. But if he is an honest member of other programs, I would consider it very unfair if he was deleted on the basis that he does not pay his members etc.

Thank you Amy!
Well said!

Amy, I will not do it to others, just him. Let him feel the sting from other webmasters for what he is doing to them, and to his members.

Still doesn't make it right Poncer. REAL webmasters...honest ones, conduct themselves in an honest fashion and don't pull crap like that. If a person is not BREAKING the rules, there is no grounds to delete them. To do so on the basis of "he deserves it" or "I don't like him" is childish, unbusiness like and will get you nowhere fast.

What would you get out of doing that David? Satisfaction? Sense of justice? Did you even consider that it would make YOU as bad as him? (ok, the word bad is not what I would associate John with because I consider him a friend)

Sorry guys.

I'm with earners on this one.

In all of the forums that deal with PTR issues, this persons name keeps coming up. And mostly in a negative context.

No point in bit**ing about him. Get rid of him so that he cannot participate. And the only ones who can do this are the webmasters. If there is no legitimate reason to boot him out of your site, then fine. Stand by your decision to keep him active in your programs. But the minute he offends you or your program, don't come crying to the forums. I'm starting to lose sympathy for people who defend him one minute and want to crucify him the next.

Hey Vicky, this the first time we seem to be disagreeing on something.

LOL. I know!!

If you are a webmaster you have to treat your members fairly. How can I be justified in booting someone if they have done nothing wrong in my program? Sorry, but that is acting the same was as Venom. What's next deleting members you don't like...maybe they disagree with you here? LOL Make no sense. But hey if he would not follow the rules yes I would boot him in a heartbeat.

I think it's the first time she and I have ever disagreed on anything, also!

But I still luv ya, In2

I agree with you 100% Amy.

I disagree with you 100% Vicky lol. But me loves ya too hon.

And who does venomx treat fairly?
He has a number of "pals" that he pays and that's it. He says what he wants and does what he wants.

And all I see are other webmasters too scared to stand up to this guy. WHY??

Why is it fair to get deleted from his program without any valid reason, or get your account deleted because you've asked when are you going to get paid.

Seems to me, you're all jumping down the wrong persons throat. Why is earners "stooping" to his level? Does it not say in most TOS that accounts can be deleted? So it's OK for venom to do this but no one else can follow suit?

Sorry. Trying to follow the logic here.

I luv you too Dil and Cathy!!


Maybe we're disagreeing cause I am not a webmaster so I can look at things a little differently?

Me not a webmaster either lol.

LOL. Close enough.

Yikes, I see earners lurking :ph34r: :ph34r: I hope he does not bite my head off.

Hi Earners

Nah, I won't stoop as low as venomx. Why? I won't post people's personal info.

That is the only way a person can "stoop low"???

Nah. The only person the webmasters to punish is venomx, but nobody else. I don't think comparing apples to oranges works here either. Lets say venomx deleted many people, and the webmasters only deletes him. We technically would not stoop as low as him, as we don't do all the bad things he has done.

Well Venom and I can go round and round.......I will kick his butt.....are you reading Venom? ROFLMAO

Seriously tho....as long as people follow my program rules and guidelines I have no problem. I don't think it's good for anyone to just delete people for no reason....and I will say that to Venom too. Bad business.

Venomx is not stupid to keep deleting members David. He will end up having 0 in his memberbase. Webmasters can delete people like venomx if they want but that's BAD business and totally unprofessional.

I know we are not comparing apples and oranges or bananas and grapes either for that matter. We are talking about a webmaster who is not breaking any rules in any other program and who is running his sites the way HE wants.

It's very tempting to want to do the "eye for an eye" thing. Believe me, I sometimes feel that I could hold a grudge until 200 years after I am dead; sometimes I have to struggle against that feeling. The way I see it, I am only responsible for the behavior of one person--myself. I really just try to do the best I can, and if other people want to be scuzz balls, that is not in my jurisdiction.

Hey kglaser