I wonder why no one else has heard about this "company".

You dealt with them 2 months ago. Have any other WM had any contact with this "company"?

This is a busy forum, maybe when those two topics that I posted the link too appeared they just slipped past most members,
I mean after all they didn't have Ays, stomach, or Linder in the title, lol, Maybe these days Dana is another word in the title, that wouldn't slip past unnoticed by more than a few,, adly,
"Sorry Dana!" oh well it will be someone else next week won't it,

Weird thing. I guess they train fellow Hindi in doing ptr, pay them in local currency and try to recover the payout money in dollars from the ptr-site?

Are there no Hindi members on this board who could jump in at this thread and maybe give some explanations about this program?
Or could at least post in the Hindi forum to try find some members of it?

(presuming the Hindi forum on this board has opened already, I didn't check it out yet..)

Hhhmm, I read the thread at AYS forum just now, and there is one thing that draws my attention:

The OP posted his signup letters, dated May 18, 2004. The samePC logs posted by AYS contain quite some dates BEFORE May 18th???

Yeah Alex, I've had the same problem, and discovered that most of them are using forms of cheatware and/or blind clicking

So maybe THAT IS the training they receive and pay for?? They train them how to cheat? But then again, I don't get why on earth they actually PAY members their balance once they've reached payout level (that's why password and username is required from the member) and it's been verified by OP at AYS forum that he HAS BEEN paid by PPIPL.

And then what?? They are willing to take over member's account and wait sometimes really long time to get paid themselves?? What's the point of doing it? Perhaps the owner of PPIPL has biult huge downlines using this scheme and at the end of the day also owns all these endless accounts?? Can somebody please enlighten me here? As I'm completely lost


Tati

Looks like a phishing site to me, to harvest passwords, and rip off accounts. If this has been said, sorry. I really didn't want to go back through the whole thread, and just tossed in my 5 cents worth.

I just found out about this program yesterday. It certainly explains all the sign ups we have had from India, mostly from the city of Mumbai. It's been about two months here as well, and I am now deleting a lot of these members for inactivity.

I wrote to PPIPL yesterday and asked them to remove our program name from their "scheme" as we want nothing to do with it. Have not received an answer and we are still listed there.

I did notice while looking around that you can "earn while you learn," but I, too wasn't sure what you were learning. I also got the impression that these members pay to join this program which is very, very sad.

Oh, that's lovely. I can see the ads now: don't just get screwed -pay us to do it to you!

Mero

You missed my point Mero

What do you think about this? They DO PAY their members and that's what I fail to understand


Tati

Tati, I did see your post before, but I was just so confused by this whole scam that I had exactly the same questions myself, LOL. Most scams, you figure out by following the money, but I couldn't figure out where PPIL was getting any money.

Then Nibor's post gave me a different perspective. Now, I re-read the initial quote Teedy brought over, and the person never actually says they've BEEN paid by PPIL, only that they expect to be (whether or not AYS pays PPIL). Nibor thinks the members actually pay PPIL for whatever service they supposedly provide. If so, bingo - there's the money.

So... let's suppose the members of PPIL pay PPIL for... whatever - could be training to cheat, could be currency exchange, maybe both, maybe something else. In exchange for that, they expect to make money in PTR's and have PPIL do the currency exchange for them. This would allow PPIL to take their members' money and run.

The one problem I have with this is: why did they even bother to log in to the member's PTR (AYS in this case) account? Most scams that promise a service for money wouldn't even bother to go through the motions.

So once again I am totally lost here. Maybe PPIL thought they could really pull this off, and didn't realize all the PO's would catch on before they got any cash. But that seems unlikely, because you always hear about these trained rings of cheaters from India and China.

Never mind, I just totally went in a circle and have no idea what legitimate or illegitimate plan PPIL has... yeah, I got nuthin'.

Mero

Here's the link to the original AYS thread:
http://www.allyousubmitters.com/forums/ind...=20&#entry52163

and here's the snippet form OP's post:

So as you can see they DO pay members when they reach payout level (and that's why they need their passwords so they can verify this info. and yes members PAY THEM to join the "scheme" and receive the training (perhaps they hand them cheat-bots as part of this training??)

So it's still not clear to me what PIPPL does with the member's accounts once they paid them what's earned on these accounts. Where's PIPPL's profit here? Perhaps they don't pay them 100% but let's say 50% or even 75% ??

Just trying to think logically here
Tati

It's one of those mysteries that we will never figure out, unless someone actually wants to join the site and see what happens....any takers?

Oy. this just gets weirder. Thanks for the post where it says Krishn did get paid - I didn't see that.


Yeah, you're making good points, but I'm stuck right where you are: how is PPIL making money here?

I keep thinking maybe Krishn's lying about something, but what? What could Krishn have to gain here just from getting the balance and a couple of other details that (s)he keeps asking for?

Do you think Krishn really WAS paid by AYS via PPIL at some point?

Aw, man. I've written like 12 paragraphs and deleted them all. I keep coming up with something, but it always turns out to be nothing.

I'm afraid Bobbie might be right. Maybe somebody around here has seen something similar and knows how it works, but it sounds like to me the PO's who've commented have no idea, and none of us has yet come up with a rock-solid idea here. Very frustrating. I hope other PO's on that list are seeing this thread - they need to be aware.

Mero

Yeahh, I think (s)he has been paid and that's why (s)he was so persistant about posting the balance. But it totally puzzles me. Perhaps it's possible to "track" this perticular downline and check who's the main upline of all those indian members and it'll be the answer?

Tati

If you go to http://pluspointinfotech.com/main.html now it says this

Dear Members

Our site was meant to guide and educate in Internet & make people aware of what PTR Industry is, which has got a lot of potential, but some people have mis-understood the entire concept as a result of which we will have to renovate our site.

INCONVINIENCE REGRETTED

ADMINISTRATION



all other pages that were posted in the thread at ays are gone

I know I'm a pushover, but I think they may have had good intentions as far as their members go.

Unfortunately, teaching people who don't understand English well how to operate a PTR program still isn't honest.

They felt there was potential in the PTR industry but people from countries who can't participate in searches really have to struggle to reach payout at most programs. And if you can't understand English, you will most likely lose your account anyway.

I had to delete one person from India yesterday who had earned $15 in PTSU's in 2 months. She/he had signed up and claimed some of the programs more than once. I think it was because they didn't understand what they were doing.

Of course, I might be all wrong and this is just a way to cheat.

Well, if this person was paid by AYS through PPIL, then has that damaged AYS? Or would the person have been paid anyway? IF the only indication of cheating was the shared computer, and we take Krishn's word (for the sake of argument) that PPIL caused that, then it sounds like no harm was done to AYS.

But I still hope other PO's are aware of this, b/c it sounds like a problem, whether PPIL had good intentions or not, because you just can't be logging into a bunch of accounts at ANY PTR on the same computer. If PPIL doesn't know this, then they have hurt their members with their ignorance - which in this case is inexcusable, given that the computer sharing rule is right there in the terms for anyone to see.

And if PPIL WAS aware you can't share computers, then they were up to something. I just can't imagine what.

As for what Princessah is reporting... hopefully that'll be the end of it, and maybe no damage was done to any PTR.

But I think damage may have been done to the members of PPIL. Even if they were being trained to cheat, they might not have known that. If they couldn't read the ToS for themselves due to lack of English comprehension, they might have trusted PPIL to tell them what to do, and not even realized they were getting bad advice.

While Krishn obviously has a fine command of English, I can't help but wonder if the reason we didn't hear from someone else who had their account logged on that shared computer is because the others don't speak enough English to post about it.

Or not. I could be totally misreading this whole thing. Definitely very strange.

Mero

Well I know my site has had a lot of India members sign up in the past several months, and most from Mumbai as well. Most of our signups have never earned anything. This tells me they must me using a cheat software which will not click anything in our emails.

Another site that I am helping with had a member that had asked for an email stating something about not having an agreement with some company. They didn't mention the name of the company but after finding out about this I would bet its the same company. I emailed them asking about the company but hadn't heard back from them. She was trying to get 5 sites to send an email to this company so she could get back her 29.95 (I think it was).

In my opinion here, I think they are having their members pay them this 29.95 which would add up really quick. Then they show them what to do to work the sites. Now most of these people are not going to be able to understand english. They show them what not to click and what to watch out for ect. Since India's money is rupees it would be feasible that they want to sign in and veryify their earnings so they can pay them in rupees and have the american dollars put into their accounts. I would bet they only pay them a certain percentage of the actual amount. Hence more money in their pockets. Plus all the while they are building a huge downline as well to earn even more money. More than likely it would take a lot of rupees to equal an american dollar. So that would mean these people are getting paid when the money is received by PPIPL. Their member is happy getting X amount of rupees while PPIPL is pocketing money as well.

So they could be earning this:

29.95 signup fee at PPIPL
possible pocketing of partial earnings
earnings from downlines that they have built up

Looks to me like they would be earning a pretty good sum. Remember this is just my theory.

dalrose

DalRose, that makes sense.

I noticed Leigh-Ann of Derby Dollars sent out two emails, the second one stating flat out that she doesn't know what PPIL is doing, but she has nothing to do with it and wants to make sure none of the members do either.

I don't think ANYONE is sure what this company is up to, but I hope all the PO's hear about it in time to avoid problems for them. I wish the members could be protected, too, but obviously it's not that simple to get the word out to them.

What REALLY ticks me off here is with all the hoards of cheaters we all hear about, it's very depressing to think some of them may just be getting innocently used by companies training them to cheat without telling them they're doing anything wrong.

On the other hand, it might restore some POs' faith in humanity if they found out not all of the hoards of cheaters are intentionally breaking rules, but rather have been misled by a third party.

Mero

I read an article a month or so ago in our local paper (U.S.) that was talking about a new industry in India. It interviewed an Indian lady who was talking about getting paid to read email programs. In the interview, she talked about opening an email and waiting for the timer to run out. Then she would go on to the next. In the interview she said that she was not interested in what the advertisement was about, just in waiting until the timer ran out and then going to the next email. According to the article, this was becoming big business in India.

Which would probably toward confirming that the ppipl type are:
Kind of recruitment business.
You pay to become a member, to be part of their "employees" list.
They send you on various task, like PTR.
They even train them to do the minimum required to participate.

A bit like emails I used to receive:
$xxx will get you registered on our recruitment list. We will send you a package with all info

Hmmm. This sounds like she was following terms - there's no requirement to care about the ads so long as you read what you're supposed to. Or was there more to it that sounded like cheating?

The only reason I'm pretty sure PPIL is up to no good is that they are claiming to have agreements with these sites, and at least some of the sites deny it. And it makes no sense from the sites' perspective to agree to let someone access the accounts from a shared company computer, does it?

Mero

I found ppipl on a few searchs I did, google etc but couldn't translate
I didn't know what language some of the results were in,

This jogged my memory of a thread on this forum about that article and I just found it. You can read it here http://www.grimy.org/~broke_kid/archive/000056.html


An interesting quote from the article:

That doesn't sound like PTR, exactly. I mean, 25 cents a click, and what's the deal with paying website hosting??? It sounds like a specific marketing scheme, which may exist. Maybe PPIL is trying to mimic this with PTR?

But either way, they're doing it without permission from the sites.

Mero

The problem here is that most of the India members that are with this PPIPL do not understand english. This will make it hard for those of us with english sites to get thru to them. Which in the first place most of our websites state must be able to read english. We can't just delete all India members as there are a few of them that do understand english. This just makes things harder for all the PO's. From what I've understood this PPIPL site has taught them what english words to avoid. So the problem now lies in how to clean up our membership databases so as not to hurt any honest members.

dalrose

A lot of these members sign up but then never do anything which means they will go inactive. I've been deleting quite a few of them the past few days.

The second thing I've found, is that a lot of them are signing up for PTSU's and not claiming the credits correctly and/or signing up for the same programs twice. I found one today who, while he didn't get credit for the sign-up because he didn't submit the correct information, I couldn't find anything else wrong with his account, so he will have another chance. He will probably end up going inactive.

Another thing is that once these members sign up for a program, they often send e-mails to support asking for more mail. There was one yesterday and today (with PPIPL in his e-mail address), who said his mailbox was hungry.

Just some things to watch for, but I don't think this is really hurting the programs a whole lot. The members who can understand English are welcome, the ones who don't will most likely end up being deleted for one thing or another.

I have had several in the past few weeks that have asked for more emails. I did notice a time or two that these that requested more didn't have many interest checked or they didn't have any earnings since signup. I don't remember for sure if they were from India though but probably were. It also makes me think that they are using a cheat software. Maybe they have been trained in cheat software as well. Our site has a wording so that cheat software will think that all of our emails are to catch cheaters. I also have had quite a few email and ask what is a cheat link. I will be keeping a closer eye on all of these to see if it is part of this India group of PPIPL's.

If they use translators wouldn't they be able to read the emails and sites that are sent out on PTR's? The reason I ask this is so many times when they send a support email their english is not very well put.

dalrose

Guess what! Just found another one. Keep an eye on members that sign up for 10 or 15 new programs a day without submitting the correct information for claiming the PTSU.

I just saw an e-mail address I thought looked "funny," so I typed it into my browser and came up with another company in India doing the same thing. This one seemed a little easier to read.

It's called iteamnetwork.com

Taken from their concept page


I'm very curious about the running software part.

I just clicked the "Join Us" button and it took me to Paypal where the amount of $40 US was showing for a Platinum membership.

Here we go again.

Those "companies" are terrible.
Those poor indians are being taken advantage of.

Even if they pay at first, it cannot last.

Either and/or:
1- Get India banned
2- kill the GPT world

Hope there is a solution to this and soon.
Maybe they should learn them to read/understand english.
They could still make money, but at least it would be more usefull to those users.

wow, where do I begin on how I feel about this ppipl situation, except to say that it is quite obvious what they're intentions are, just from what I have read so far here. And these intentions are nothing more than an attempt to scam innocent people out of their money ( Not their PTR earnings but what they paid ppipl for their membership).
I truelly feel these ppipl people do realize that these member's who pay them for their service will eventually have their accounts terminated from those listed PTR sites they get them to sign up for.
It's quite simple what they are doing, they get people to pay a fee for their service, get them to sign up for PTR's, do the clicks, then access their acounts and obviously get their accounts deleted by doing so, thus pocketing the fee the member initially paid them for their so-called service.
This is illegal, and I'm sure it is no matter what country a person lives, for any company or business to charge a fee for someone to earn an income.
If I were these people from India who are being taken advantage of,I would suggest to them that they contact their local policing authority or government and have this company thouroughly investigated and punished to the highest extent of their laws in India, this is just plain and out right "SICK!!!!!" that people can do such things to people from a country that has enough troubles with people living in poverty and are obviously doing what they are doing to try to get by; people that can be so calous as these ppipl people just makes me wanna "Ralph in the Big white telephone.....Beullaaaah .....you their?"

That "concept page" Robin quoted sounded just like a regular PTR or surfbar ad from a few years ago... until you had to get in touch with someone for the "how" of it b/c they couldn't tell you. A normal ad would have explained you click ads and let timers run out while looking at ads, or you surf and get points, etc. Nothing complicated or secret about that. The fact that you have to contact someone to hear more DOES make it sound like they're training people to cheat.

But I'm doubting the people who subscribe to these services realize they're cheating, and that's sad. Probably, PPIL plans to tell the people, "Hey, you lost your PTR account b/c you cheater - that's not our fault, so we'll keep your sign-up fee, thanks, and good riddance to you". Sweet.

Mero

O.K, this comment I am about to post is for anyone here who maybe from India.
First off I am a Canadian, and I just got off the phone with an agency here called "Phonebuster's" who deal in fraud situations, and do deal in international issues if it pertains to Canada as well.They suggested to me that people from India could contact them if they feel they have been taken advantage of by these "Scams". If the issue is not affecting Canadians, they will still help you, they will take your concerns and advice you as to who to contact in your country our may even contact those authorities themselves.
They advice that when you contact them to have as much info on the so-called "Scam" as you can supply them such as:
-Site name
-Site address
-Domain registration info if you can get it
-Site's contact info, including any business physical address and phone number's if listed on site
-Company owner's name if it can be obtained
-If you paid via a credit card, and have the credit card or bank statements, wil also be helpful

Unfortunately, you would have to contact them either by email or long distance by phone as their 1-888 number isn't avalable to India, however the person I spoke with informeed me that they may soon have a phone number for international caller's in the near future. Also I would advice that if you are not fluent in English you have someone who is contact them as they don't have anyone who speaks Hindi or Punjabi at this time.
So here is the info you need to contact them:

info@phonebusters.com

or call:

1-705-495-8501

well I contacted phonebuster's again, as I couldn't read the phone number I had written down that they gave me, and a different person answered the phone. I asked her if she could give me the long-distance number again and she thought I was calling to file a complaint, even though I said no that I had called earlier just to inquire what someone form India could do , however she still thought I was filing a complaint for a particular company. So I did tell her the details of what's been going on with these so-called program's that hve popped -up supposedly from Inidia and how they oppeate and are blatently taking advantage of inoccent people.
I mentioned to her that one site has already obviously closed up shop but a new one has appeared to have taken it's place, and they apparently originate form the same city or town in India.
I gave her as much info regarding this new site as I could including the fact that this new site that popped up requires a fee of $40.
She opened up a file on this one, which I didn't excpect since I wasn't originally calling to make a formal complaint myself, she said it would be better now so that if anyone else calls regarding this new company and the previous one, as she also wanted that as well,they would at least have some record of it on file for further referrence.
Also I would like to say, the other receptionist I spoke with suggested that even though these sites seem to originate out of India, their could be a slim possability they could maybe originate from either Canada or the U.S as well, as sometimes "Scams" don't necessarily devuldge their real locations, hoping that they won't be traced.
So the name of the company on file is : ITEAM Network.com if anyone else feels this may be a suspicious site or may have already been frauded by them. The contact info to Phonebuster's is in my above post

Edited to add: The last lady I spoke with at Phonebuster's also asked if they could have my permission to pass on the info I gave them to any other authority if they deemed it neccesary, which I granted them. But because they get at least 2000 calls a day reporting frauds, it would be up to them wether they decide to investigate this issue or pass it on to another agency, which they will more than likely do if this site does in fact originate from India.

it seems these so-called companies operate in the same fashion of that of a phone-solictation racket. In other words, they have a temporary location; when they feel the heat is on and their close to getting caught, they close up shop and re-locate. Since the two companies in question seem to originate from the same city or town in India, this would lead me to believe that this is something similar to a phone-solicttion scheme via the internet. And would also lead me to believe that it could very wel be possable they were run by the same poeple.

My advice to anyone:

When a program asks you to pay a fee in order for you to get paid:

IT IS ILLEGAL!!!

Run, don't look back, DO NOT, I repeat, DO NOT JOIN!!!! YOU"LL GET BURNED!!!

if anyone can translate this advice in Pujabi or Hindi , be my guest

I informed Paypal of this, and I hope they take action

good job, charmeyn. Thank you for helping out. Like it was said earlier, most of these people from India may not realize what scams they are being asked to participate in. So many are in poverty, anythign that promises money quick and easy is eye candy to them and they may not think about what the company is tyring to do and such. We need to look out for each other, regardless of the country, regardless of the situation.

Perhaps a mods of relative forums here could translate it and post in their folders
Should we alert them or they read it here?

Tati

I think we should do both, alert them in their folder in their language as well as having them be able to read it hear if they can understand english .
If a mod that understands Hindi or Punjabi can translate my posts for them that would be great

Thank you Hosthunter, I'm always glad to help whenever I can. It just sickens me that there are people in this world that have such disregard for other people and take advantage of the less fortunate and their cucumstances, not saying that all people in India fall into this catagory, but there are the majority that do, infortunately.
It sort of reminds me of those stories you hear about from overseas countries who use children to manufacture rugs to sell to tourists and pay them very little, if anything at al, for their labour's.
I don't know what it is like over in India, as I have never been there, but I should hope they have similar consumer protection laws over there as we do have here in Canada that protect them from situations such as this, and would advice them that they look into it.

well I came a cross an Indian message board that cater's to making money online, and the postings were in English, so I joined it and left a message, lets hope and pray they read it and head the warnings I conveyed to them:

http://messages.indiainfo.com/ubb/Forum39/HTML/000314.html

I also posted a new topic at this messge board with same warning in my previous message so It will be noticed, hopefully

http://messages.indiainfo.com/ubb/Forum39/HTML/000700.html